Sexism in Fireworks

[pyrotech1]

I have personally witnessed sexism amongst my coworkers towards my wife in regards to her being on the crews. It seems that the attitude of "thats a mans job" or "a woman shouldn't be doing this work" seems to still run rampant. While I sort of expect it from the 50+ age group because of the generation, She's getting it from the guys my age (early 30s).
Before I get any further let me explain the background of the situation.
I started working for this company a little over a year ago. My wife decided that she wanted to join me to "see what it was about." Now, a year and a month later we have done approx. 25 shows together, and (because she was able to make some that I couldn't) she's worked about 35-40 total. Don't think that she's the priss type. She's right there moving racks, dropping shells, and wiring (faster than most others) right along side the guys. She's smart, motivated and able. I just led my first show a few weeks ago and now she wants her turn. When she asked one of the other crew members told her flat out "I won't listen to a female lead."
The company owner is concerned about giving her a lead position because he "doesn't know if he'll be able to find a crew that will follow her lead.

[pyrochik]

As a female in fireworks (this is the wife) i think its unfair that i am not treated equally. i have busted my ass to prove that i can more than keep up. while yes i do have things that i need to learn, i think i have more than earned my place. between being at the storage facility pulling shows all summer and working between 30-40 shows over the last year, i think its a load of crap that guys still treat me like a lil priss who cant handle it. im ordinarily the one shoving my arm down the tube to get the garbage out cause i cant wait for someone to find the damn cleaning stick. i can out wire most of the guys on each crew. while i cant lift some of the boxes, i think its time the men realize its not just a guys world. women enjoy blowing shit up too.

[noel]

In the rest of the corporate world there would be lawsuits because of statements like that.......

Originally Posted by pyrotech1

The company owner is concerned about giving her a lead position because he "doesn't know if he'll be able to find a crew that will follow her lead.

[harddrive8]

personally, i have no problems with women being in fireworks. As long as they are willing to help out - be it lift boxes, drop shells, squib shells, throw racks around, whatever. I've shot on a lot shows where women were helping before and after the show. And even worked a few where women were in there lighting the shells too! It's a shame that anybody would get told something like that. I really hope a few peoples remarks won't turn you against the professional industry as a whole.

Joe

[zgnf05]

That's sad to hear I would build my own crew and keep going cannot please everyone you know.

Z

[FWX006]

My wife works in our fireworks company, in fact she owns it!

We have had a problem in the past with some of the guys, but they get told that they can either suck it up or go somewhere else. Discrimination on grounds of gender is plain illegal in this country.

If that situation occurred here the boss wouldn't have a leg to stand on. He would either have to give her the job on merit and piss the crew off or basically break the law.

I wouldn't get out of fireworks altogether, but why would you guys want to work with a bigoted assholes?

[stuntborg]

Sounds to me like its time for you to move on. I'll follow anyone that shows me they are worthy of being followed. I don't care if you are male, female, or undecided. All that matters is the quality of your work.

stuntborg

[JoeRatman]

Merged duplicate threads.

[jknepp1954]

Originally Posted by pyrochik

As a female in fireworks (this is the wife) i think its unfair that i am not treated equally. i have busted my ass to prove that i can more than keep up. while yes i do have things that i need to learn, i think i have more than earned my place. between being at the storage facility pulling shows all summer and working between 30-40 shows over the last year, i think its a load of crap that guys still treat me like a lil priss who cant handle it. im ordinarily the one shoving my arm down the tube to get the garbage out cause i cant wait for someone to find the damn cleaning stick. i can out wire most of the guys on each crew. while i cant lift some of the boxes, i think its time the men realize its not just a guys world. women enjoy blowing shit up too.

Go for it Girl!
I think the problem is you might "bruise the male ego" more than anything!
Joyce

[Pyro Nut]

Originally Posted by pyrochik

while yes i do have things that i need to learn, i think i have more than earned my place.

As most of us do. We are always learning from each other and in doing so have earned a spot in being a professional. Never, ever be afraid of asking questions. There is never a "dumb" question when it comes to our hobby....

Originally Posted by pyrochik

women enjoy blowing shit up too.

You'll fit right in.....

Good luck in your endevors...

[DennyMo]

Any guy who has problems taking orders from a female boss probably has issues with his mother. Or is grossly insecure in his manhood. I can't believe how many wimps we have in this world.

Who's the goober who voted for "kitchen"? Reminds me of a bumper sticker I saw years ago: "A woman's place is in the House - or the Senate!"

[stuntborg]

Who's the goober who voted for "kitchen"?

I'd like to know this as well. Are you a "man" enough to admit that you think women should be in the kitchen?

stuntborg

[Pyro Nut]

Originally Posted by DennyMo

Who's the goober

Haven't heard that phrase used in probably 20 years or so, thanks for reminding me how old I am........

[shrapnel]

Say what you will boy's but...95% of you would NEVER vote for a woman for president. Never been done in our history, likely never will. The fact that Hillary is running is just people humoring her. So, I'm curious...where DO you draw the line?

[Firecracker-Jim]

I have nothing against girls in the pyro industry at all and plus my g/f got into pyro the last show i did and it was damn sexy seeing a girl do pyro if you ask me

[Marty]

The females on my crews generally work circles around the guys and take greater pride in what they accomplish.

[missinglink]

Originally Posted by shrapnel

Say what you will boy's but...95% of you would NEVER vote for a woman for president. Never been done in our history, likely never will. The fact that Hillary is running is just people humoring her. So, I'm curious...where DO you draw the line?

Oink! Oink! You are kidding right?

To be truthful ... all the women bosses I ever had worked my ass off. Most ladies have had to fight hard to get into postions of authority and tend to be more demanding than the guys. I suspect that if a woman is elected as President of this USA she will be an exceptional person for having made it in what is still an "Old Boys" world. Soon enough the ole' sexist dinosaurs will become extinct but sexism is not entirely a generational thing. Men naturally want to dominate women. You can take the man out of the cave but face it.. we are still all cavemen at heart.

Oh yeah... I hijacked the thread..

pyrochik... don't let them cow you. Rocket J. Squirrel has a point... but if you really can keep up and do the same quality work then keep at it. You will earn their respect...

[RPS]

Originally Posted by shrapnel

Say what you will boy's but...95% of you would NEVER vote for a woman for president. Never been done in our history, likely never will.

I would, and current national polls suggest a lot more than 5% support... Even Pakistan has had a female head of state (Benazir Bhutto), is the US really that weak that we can't do it?

I've worked under a female lead once and she did a great job. My gf helped me handfire a small 1.4G show last summer and did a good job too.

[pauljuno]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I wish that most of our politicians had half the cojones of Margaret Thatcher. Male or Female shouldn't matter, the ability to do the job is the important thing.

[Arthur Brown]

I really want an option that says -Yes if competent and lawful.

I worked for one company (not pyro, and UK based) where the bosses wife took over control - she hadnt a clue she started replacing male managers with women with no regard for competence the company collapsed in two years.

I'd be worried by a feminine pyro company locally as they might be better than me! Women often do the art bits very differently from men. A feminine designed show could be VERY different from a male designed one.

An employer that based hiring or promotion on gender in the UK would be on a very difficult pitch.

[yeagerb]

We have many husband/wife shoot teams and female workers too! All seem to "keep up" and like Marty said, generally work as hard or harder them the male counterparts! I guess I'm blessed yet again...Premier is an equal opportunity display company. The only requirement is that your dedicated to Pyrotechnic Perfection, regardless of sex, creed, religion, color, ethnicity, etc, etc, etc.... O - and you can pass a BATFE background check too....

[pyrochik]

I agree pc bs ruins everything. I can more than keep up. I know my limits when it comes to carrying the heavier equipment but i always find something else to do (like attaching the H brackets) while the guys are doing other things. If there were another company in the area i probably would go.

[glittertime]

Originally Posted by shrapnel

....95% of you would NEVER vote for a woman for president. Never been done in our history, likely never will...

I wouldn't say "Never", but I don't think you'll see it in this generation.

[pyrochik]

having grown up being considered a tomboy, i have always been thought of as one of the guys. when it comes to belching in public, having a dirty mind or a foul mouth...guys tend to think of me as one of them. yet when i actually decide to go the nine and they see me in makeup and a dress and heals they are reminded that i am a girl and start treating me differently when they see me in jeans and a tshirt.

I was always one of those girls who was playing in the mud and getting my hands dirty. I dont want to step on any toes but the fact that half the time my racks are wired before anyone else should say something. and my wires can always be traced back to their origin (im a stickler for neatness). All i need is a beat in my head, whether it be via my ipod or im humming the theme song to batman, my fingers just go. i enjoy doing the shows and proudly speak of the company i work for when in public. people are either shocked, appalled, or amazed that a girl loves doing fireworks displays.

im usually the one in the back of the trailer slinging the racks out to the guys. If im not i am picking up the racks and hauling them right along with everyone else. i have no problem team lifting a rack that has been set up and moving it, turning it, or completely relocating it. yea im small and cant lift anything over a 5" rack alone. ive said it before and i will say it again. i know my limits and i find something else to do to keep the job rolling.

When it comes to leading a show. if i have to i will find my own crew that i know will follow my instructions. I have no problem telling people on a crew who wont listen to a female that they can walk. just means more money and fun for the ones who are willing to work with me. to me it just means that they are more dedicated to our "hobby".

to whom ever said that women belong in the kitchen. the field is my kitchen. if you cant take the heat....then get out of MY kitchen. I am determined to prove myself.

[Randall]

I believe a woman on a shoot I was working on would be a safety concern.

After 4.5 years in a miserable monogamous relationship, She would distract me, then I'd blow myself up!

Yea, it's Friday.

On a more sane note, I have a new employee that I get the feeling I am training to take over my job, and she could probably get it if she wanted, and do a very good job.

[glittertime]

Originally Posted by yeagerb

....O - and you can pass a BATFE background check too....

What??? No conspirators, crooks, thugs, terrorists, or generally mean people allowed? What's the fun in that?

[leeca]

Originally Posted by shrapnel

Say what you will boy's but...95% of you would NEVER vote for a woman for president. Never been done in our history, likely never will. The fact that Hillary is running is just people humoring her. So, I'm curious...where DO you draw the line?

Better take another look at the Polls ... Hillary is in first place... Must be more than 5% saying they plan on backing her... I’m one of them and will be looking forward to having her as president.

I also have nothing but respect for female Pyro’s; the few I have had a chance to work with have been an inspiration.

[Don F]

A woman just as a man can do anything they set their mind to .
Ive seen guys on shoots that will completely ignore a woman who's working beside them. More often than not these are the ones trying to be manly men ,who are under the mistaken idea that women arent tough enough or should be submissive and wearing dresses.(any man thats ever been in the delivery room when his children were born know better than this BS) The same rabid "christian conservative" attitude that doesnt think women should be teachers because no woman should ever lead a man (no thats not aimed at anyone here but it is an attitude Ive heard from a number so called men.)
I agree with other put your own crew together , train them well . there are a number of reason to do this one if the guys are giving you attitude then you can't trust them. On a shoot site you are trusting every person there with your life . I personally will not work with someone I dont feel I can trust.

[shrapnel]

There are a number of jobs out there that REQUIRE a minimum amount of weight to be lifted, Clerks, Warehouses, Docks, UPS, USPS etc etc. These company's can and will test you on and can legally decide to hire / not hire you on this ability alone. Doesn't matter what color / sex you are, it's physical ability.

We are completely different specimens (Men are from Venus, Women are from Mars) Anyone here who has or knows some one who works in a place that is majority female, can tell you nightmare stories of the general atmosphere, women are catty by nature. You put 5 girls on a project and your guaranteed to have compatability issues. "She said this, She said that, can you believe what she's wearing!" And more often than not, among women...she with the largest chesticles is the least liked....

Put 5 guys on a project and your much more likely to see bonding, cooperation, and plans made to hit the bar or fishing trip for the weekend, all while maintaining production. If there is a disagreement, a simple F%# You, a short argument, and then it's back to work and talkin about that fishing trip. Not the lifelong hatred I have seen women display for co-workers. I have seen several women in tears, hours after they leave the job, because of how they were treated, more often by another woman than a man. I think a good mix of both sex's can be the best option.

Pyrochick....I don't think you fall into the above general description, and I wish you the best it sounds like you would definatly be an asset to any company. I am simply voicing an issue that is out there and is dealt with by managers on a daily basis. These are not my opinions, they are real life issues that no one can deny to be true.

Anywho...grab a hot dog and flame away now!...

[glittertime]

Originally Posted by shrapnel

...women are catty by nature...
Put 5 guys on a project..a simple F%# You, a short argument, and then it's back to work

Might be some truth to that "women and catty" thing, I guess it's debateble as are most things. On the other hand, men are much more likely to be "back stabbers" and "double dealers". I've seen (and experienced) more of that than I've cared to.