Recent Information re: the NY State S and S Bill

[cands]

Im totaly lost here. I cant find anything on this subject. I read a little after the 4th of july NY was going to go safe n sane, I havnt heard anything about it since. Anybody have any information on this?

[Richard]

As you know, the safe and sane bill was passed by the senate and is in the assembly. I would urge you to continue to write to your assemblymen in support of it. The other issue involves a permit for the aerial items. I spoke with Bill Weimer, vice president of Phantom Fireworks this morning, and ran the idea by him of a fireworks safety course for the permit being developed by the fireworks industry. He felt that the course that the PGII offers would do nicely. I would hope that his could be the case but the logistics would have to be worked out. Since Bill was instumental with the safe and sane legislation, I asked his opinion about the permit and he agreed with me that we should proceed slowly, even if it was restrictive. If all went well, we could try to change it later. The permit idea will be discussed in the senate in 2006 This is all food for thought and nothing has been decided. Please continue to write but try to be realistic. We're dealing with a number of folks who have some pretty strong feelings about fireworks, both pro and con.

[Pyro4life1]

Thanks for the update Rich, I really hope we get the permit/s&S bill threw

[Pyroman6000]

Is this the bill that makes possession of non-safe and sane fireworks a misdemenor? I am DEFINITELY NOT in support of that! I realize that provision is there to pander to the Rudy Guilliani types, but come on... For illegal sales, maybe, for possession of illegal explosive , definitely, but mere possession?? Doesn't fit the "crime" it is a victimless statutory violation. Why lump someone with a few reloadables or candles in with the drug addicts?

As for violations for sales, they should have to actually PROVE that you sold them-via sales to an officer or something like it. that possession of more than x amount = intent to sell is B.S.! As all of us know, in order to produce a decent display you need a pretty significant quantity. Certainly far in excess of any so called "Threshold" amount. BIG difference between a guy(s) with several cases of stuff for a show and someone with a few oz's of coke or pot!

Hey, a guy can dream can't he?

I'm all for progress in this respect, but not as a front for another smackdown. Permits?? HECK YEAH!!! Fully in support of that, at least it gives us a real way to get and stay legal. A DOL S&P license is major overkill, and that's assuming they will even issue it when they learn what you want it for! I like the safety course Idea a lot. Fireworks have been totally illegal in NY for several generations now. Public education is needed before throwing any doors wide open. Most non-pyros have no idea what this stuff is or does.
I'd also leave it up to the local jurisdictions. NYC, for example already has their own laws regarding fireworks, and a new state law would not change that. In heavy population density areas, safe and sane is the best way to go unless you can prove you have somewhere SAFE to shoot. I think most of us can agree that there is no good reason to shoot rockets, for instance, in a typical urban neighborhood. Too many exposures, and too many people. In the boonies (more than 85% of NY by the way), it's a different matter- there is lots more space, and fewer neighbors to annoy- or to unwittingly enter the hazard zone. I still say, at least for now, that we need to demonstrate competence before we get to play with the big stuff.

my $.02

[Richard]

I understand that some of you do not like the proposed safe and sane legislation as is. Neither do I, but this was all that we could get because of some vehement opposition in the legislature, especially from downstate assemblymen who were influenced by firefighters and 9/11. At least with the permit, we would have legal access to all or almost all 1.4. As I said before, just getting the current S&S bill was a tough, uphill battle. Tradeoffs had to be made. It was all we could get so I'd rather have something that we could build on rather that go for everything and wind up with nothing. I've been fighting for legalization for many, many years and even the current S&S bill is a breath of fresh air. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, of course, but I feel that we should put our energy into at least getting something started. I'm just as frustrated as the next guy because we've been without fireworks for about 65 years, but misconceptions on the part of some legislators die hard . They need to see that a sparkler isn't an M80 and that misleading statistics are just that. This whole thing is going to require patience and perseverance. I'd urge you to keep writing.

[Pyro4life1]

Just what would be the punishment if caught with illegals(If the permit plan doesnt go through)?

[cands]

Since its a misdamenor, its max time in jail of only a year. But this is 1.4 stuff, 1.3 would be a felony charge consisting of over a year of jail time. Of course this is just the jail side of it, as for fines I couldnt tell you.

[JoeRatman]

Merged two similar threads together.

[pyroholic]

The important thing here is to let your legislative representitive know how you feel about these changes. Talk all this up with all your pyro buddies and send those letters out. Have your pyro buddies take the message to their pyro buddies. Albany has to find out that there are an awful lot of us concerned pyro voters here. Write those letters! Spread the word! Join or start a pyro club. Don't let the anti-fw geeks turn us into criminals. "PH"

[Richard]

I've requested that the Assembly, as well as the Senate, discuss the permit idea in the 2006 legislative session. For those of you who are writing, section 405, subdivision 2, of the state's penal law is the one we're attempting to amend to include the personal use of fireworks (aerial as opposed to ground based which are classified as novelties in senate bill 4424A and assembly bill 8971). I'm pushing the fact that fireworks injuries are greater in state's that have bans (0.18 per million) as opposed to those without (0.14 million). I'm also driving home the fact that fireworks use is up 761% and injuries down 91% since the federal government established safety standards in 1976. I'm attempting to use the logical permit idea as an alternative to citizens becoming felons as a result of aerial fireworks use. I provided information regarding the Pennsylvania permit process as a starting point. As mentioned in other threads, whatever your opinion, write. Personal letters, not petitions, work wonders.

[matandch]

Uh oh! I hope this doesn't backfire. Instead of NY adopting the Pa permit idea, NY turns around and puts pressure on Pa to be more like NY and ban all fireworks.

NY has already blamed Pa law for more fireworks and guns being brought into NY.

[JoeRatman]

Merged this thread again.

Please don't keep making new threads about this topic.

[Richard]

matandch, my sense is that the NY Legislature wouldn't do this. I'm hoping that they realize that the way to curb this is to become more liberal with their laws. I've tried to impress this on them.

[Richard]

Some further thoughts about our current struggle to reform our state's fireworks ban. I've discovered over the years, as you probably have, that a number of our legislators are just plain apathetic. They will jump on the bandwagon which is current, however, after someone else has done the hard work. Don't let this dissuade you from writing, though, since their votes can make a difference with a bill's passage. Quite a few legislators have also been in office for a long time. We need to keep trying to change the 1935 mentality by exposing them to 2006 realities about fireworks. We also have a fair number of legislators who are attorneys. When you write, use statistics. Evoking images of mom and apple pie may sound nice but get us nowhere. An analogy that I've been pushing is the following: If part of the justification for the s&s bill to become law is because the NY state law should reflect federal thinking about s&s as novelties , then why shouldn't NY State law reflect federal thinking that the current group of aerial fireworks are safe enough to be used by the average consumer?

[Richard]

Some of you may have gone to the senate web site and noticed that the bill died in the assembly and was returned to the senate. Don't become disillusioned, however, since it's procedural. The Assembly didn't have time to act on the bill in 2005 so it was returned to the senate. The Assembly has it's own version of the bill (AO8971) however. The senate's is 4424A. They're both the same bill. A bill can be introduced into both houses of the legialture or can go from one to the other. The unfortunate thing is that, by law, the senate has to re-vote on it. I've been told that any fireworks bill is quite an issue in the legislature and it won't be pushed through unless there's enough interest. This is the second year of the legislative session which means that if the bill doesn't pass this year, a lot of hard work goes with it and we start from square one. Your local legislators will be the most responsive to you. I continue to recommend that you write to the governor, Senators Volker and Bruno and Assemblyman Tokasz. These gentlemen may not answer you but your letter doesn't go to waste. These fellows are very influential and letter volume means everything. For those who haven't written, you need to express your opinion. From the number of people reading these threads, there are a lot of you out there. We have an opportunity now that we haven't had in 65+ years. The bill is currently in the Codes Committee's of both houses.

[Pyro4life1]

Thanks for the update Rich, and keep 'em coming . Looks like I have some more writing to do

[Colin]

I'm going to make this thread a sticky for a while.

Perhaps somebody can provide a link to a page that gives the contact information for those legislators.

[SoonerKid]

Here are the links Colin!

http://www.state.ny.us/governor/contact/index.html
http://www.senatorvolker.com/contact_info.asp
http://www.senatorbruno.com/contact_info.asp
http://assembly.state.ny.us/mem/?ad=143&sh=con

[JoeRatman]

Merged threads of same topic.

[Richard]

I just did something interesting yesterday and contacted the Lieutenant Governor, Mary Donohue. I never considered enlisting her support before. I'm curious to see how she responds. My letters have been combining my support for the s&s bill with my disagreement on the penalties, thus the permit idea. How have the rest of you guys been faring with your correspondence? I would be surprised if you received anything totally negative since a political response often tends to be non-commital. By the way SoonerKid, thanks for posting the links.

[Richard]

The senate and assembly codes committee's have not yet discussed the fireworks bill. I believe that something will happen as the weather warms up. I'd like to add a few more statistics that you could use when writing your letters, however. Over the past 10 years, the CPSC determined that 1/3 to 1/2 of all fireworks injuries were caused by illegal items such as ashcans, cherry bombs and silver salutes. According to the United States Fire Administration, short circuits, matches, cigarettes, overloaded equipment, and even properly operated electrical equipment caused more fires than fireworks. I'll keep you posted as I learn more about the s&s bill and possible accompanying permits for the other items.

[Richard]

I was reviewing my notes today and noticed an error in one of the statistics. For those of you who are writing, there are more deaths, not injuries, in states that ban fireworks than those that don't (0.18 per million as opposed to 0.14 per million). Also, the American Pyrotechnic Association is a gold mine of useful statistical information. Try to get some of those charts into the hands of your local legislators since there's one which shows which fireworks cause the most and fewest injuries, a couple on fire statistics, and misc. other information. I've become aware that the PGI has previously offered a 1 hour safety course for 1.4G and am attempting to determine the logistics of incorporating it, PGI willing, into a permit process. There's still no word about when the Codes Committees will take up the fireworks bill.

[Richard]

I just wanted to add some more names of legislators to whom you could write: Sheldon Silver ( Democrat. Majority Leader of the Assembly-very powerful) and James Tedisco (Republican. Minority Leader of the Assembly). The address for Sheldon Silver is Albany Office, LOB 932, Albany, NY-12248 and James Tedisco is Albany Office, Lob 521, Albany, NY-12248. For those of you on Long Island, James Flanagan, the senator who co-sponsored the current S&S Bill with Senator Volker (Upstate) represents northern Long Island and is quite influential in his own right. His address is LOB 817, Albany, NY-12247. Please keep writing. Lets cause quite a stir.

[Richard]

While we're waiting for further news about the s&s bills and permit idea for non-ground fireworks, I'd be curious to know how you've been faring with your letters. Are they positive or negative? My feedback has ranged from neutral to positive, with nothing outright negative. You can e-mail me if you'd prefer.

[Pyro4life1]

I got in contact with a couple of those guys, and I never got a response

[Richard]

I'm not surprised if the lack of response came from those legislators that don't represent you, but it does surprise me if the lack of response came from your local legislators. That happened to me once many years ago and I called their Albany Office. It never happened again. Also, just becuse they don't respond doesn't mean that all is lost. I've been told that they keep folders with different categories of items and refer to them as necessary.

[phil]

Could someone tell me a list of websites I could visit to write to my local legislatures?

[Mike]

Look at post #18 in this thread above.

[phil]

I tried those already, when i clicked on them they wouldn't work for some reason.

[Mike]

Hmmmm, must be something wrong on your end. All of them worked fine for me.

BTW, I've been sending a little "southern pressure" to try and help out all you bretheren caught in New Hell....er.....uh......I mean New York.

Don't know if it will do any good, but it can't hurt either.