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Thread: Flame Projector

  1. #1
    Member Array MEMPHIS91's Avatar
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    Default Flame Projector

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/P-2C-Flame-P...#ht_1822wt_729

    Is this legal to use?
    What does it take to make a flame projector legal?
    I know I need to look at NFPA 1160

    Thanks

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    Member Array pyroscott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Quote Originally Posted by MEMPHIS91 View Post
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/P-2C-Flame-P...#ht_1822wt_729

    Is this legal to use?
    What does it take to make a flame projector legal?
    I know I need to look at NFPA 1160

    Thanks
    Flame colorant aerosol cans are continually getting stopped/refused by customs upon entry to the US. I dont know why.

    The ignition circuit needs to continually retry to light the pilot should the pilot go out and there is being a signal to fire.

    There individual parts need to be ARL or UL listed.

    There is a reason this is 150 bucks and the ones that you can get the fire marshall to approve of start at 2k and go to 10k.

    Just the parts for a flame projector that would meet those requirements would be about 1k.

    Scott

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Ah okay. So is this just for in front of an audience? What if they were really far back and not on stage?

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    Member Array pyroscott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Quote Originally Posted by MEMPHIS91 View Post
    Ah okay. So is this just for in front of an audience? What if they were really far back and not on stage?
    Doesnt matter how close to the audience it is, it still does not comply.

    Scott

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Basically no way to do it unless they are UL listed?
    What about gas mines?

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    Member Array Aerial Artistry's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Quote Originally Posted by MEMPHIS91 View Post
    Basically no way to do it unless they are UL listed?
    What about gas mines?
    cremoras/gas mines are not prox or indoor items, nfpa 160 flame effects are.. funny thing a 5gal bucket cremora this is the prox fourm so that is the direction Scott answered
    I see no reasoning you couldn't justfie to the AHJ stickicking these 70' out on an outdoor display.. but @ 70' they aren't that cool. and to do anthing realy good with them you end up with a lap top and $$ in software.

    Scott and I looked in to importing them, the fuel is the issue, it some times gets hung up in coustumes. and if you start diging you will find no one in the states will ship you fule.. no EX numbers or something like that.. so people end up shooting air freshner, starting fulid, etc..
    now this all may change as Domantor was looking to bring them in this year, you might ask shrapnel what is going on there

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Yeah I couldn't find the best place to post it.

    I should have explain I am putting them in an outdoor 1.4G ONLY display. Whats the minimum distance they can be to the audience? Cause at 70' a 1-3 meter flame is still really cool. And what if I used propane?

    Thanks so much

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    Member Array pyroscott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    If it is for use in an outdoor display, the AHJ will be more likely to allow it. However, the other player that has not been discussed yet is your insurance company. They might not allow it, it all depends on how your policy is written. If memory serves me correctly, under some policies, you cannot shoot cremora because there is no UN number for it. This issue is here in the forums somewhere.

    All the same rules follow suit for propane as well.

    Scott

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    So as long as my insurance appoves and the AHJ. Which in Oxford is my fire chief.... my neighbor..... the dude I ain't fresh boiled crawfish with last night. Lol I should have no problem? Any suggestions on a safe distance for them if the insurance doesn't tell me?

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    Member Array Aerial Artistry's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    if the AHJ approves you are good to go (like anthing) but that dosen't cover you if somthing goes wrong.
    Say it catches fire and BLEVEs the fuel source sending chunks in to the crowd, a lawyer could easily prove you weren't following code as the strict letter of the law for 160 is "before an audance" it says nothing about X distance becomes a difrent code
    you might PM Stoneypyro, He had a set of LPG ones.. they looked less then unimpressive, might have been a tempture thing
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwGF_YMkgvM
    next question is how close do you feel safe puting a propane tank to your 1.4 show??
    once you spend the time to run all the hose and enexpect each fitting and joint for leaks these things are far less exciting. I had a show once that took 3 peope 2.5 hours, checking for leaks. it sucked doing it every time the show was set up (daily for 3 mounths)
    don't forget the new fire extinguishers you will need, C02s are around $200 each, and the 110V power sorce
    trust me I have dreamed and skeamed to find a way to ligit use these cheap systems... I haven't had any luck..there is a reasoning the systems I own cost thousands not hundreds
    Last edited by Aerial Artistry; March 27th, 2012 at 10:25 AM.

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    I custom built a metal container to more than contain the blast if the propane tank BLEVEs. that's the only reason I would even consider propane in the first place.

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    I was more conserned about the spray cans.. for propane you just put a ball valve up stream of the reg

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    They aren't very impressive. Unless I can get some used.... I probably won't bother. Gas mines would be way cooler. Lol

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    Member Array pyroscott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Personally, I like colors better. I just wish there was a way to get the flames as high as propane without pressurizing the fuel. Once you pressurize the fuel, you use a LOT more of it, thus your costs are higher. Sure the effect is cool, but I am the self-proclaimed cheapskate.

    Scott

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Quote Originally Posted by pyroscott View Post
    Personally, I like colors better. I just wish there was a way to get the flames as high as propane without pressurizing the fuel. Once you pressurize the fuel, you use a LOT more of it, thus your costs are higher. Sure the effect is cool, but I am the self-proclaimed cheapskate.

    Scott
    Same here. lol I'll wait til a couple more shows pay me

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    Member Array Aerial Artistry's Avatar
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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Quote Originally Posted by pyroscott View Post
    Once you pressurize the fuel, you use a LOT more of it, thus your costs are higher.
    Scott
    tell me about it.. being able to burn $18 a sec (color fuel) per flame unit adds up, FAST

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    Default Re: Flame Projector

    Is there a reason traditional flame projectors (smokeless in a tube or a commercial equiv like Angelfire) won't work in your show?

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