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Thread: Firework Software

  1. #1
    super member Array Duncanbullet's Avatar
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    Default Firework Software

    I thought itd be interesting to find out what all fireworks software is out there,
    Free and Pay to use.

    Ill start out
    Finale fireworks (Virtual Fireworks Choregraphy Software)
    PyroIgntionControl (Musical Timing and Computerized Firing)
    2 Things always on my mind, God and Fireworks
    DuncanPyro L.L.C.
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    In the industry you have 3 systems that dominate, all of which cost $$$,
    FireOnes Scriptmaker, ShowSim and Finale.
    Within the next 2 seasons, Finale will dominate the whole market

  3. #3
    super member Array Duncanbullet's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by strobes View Post
    In the industry you have 3 systems that dominate, all of which cost $$$,
    FireOnes Scriptmaker, ShowSim and Finale.
    Within the next 2 seasons, Finale will dominate the whole market
    I forgot about showsim, i have there demo, the only thing i like about it is the 3D part, if finale could have that. They would put those other two programs out on the street
    2 Things always on my mind, God and Fireworks
    DuncanPyro L.L.C.
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by Duncanbullet View Post
    They would put those other two programs out on the street
    Yes and no. ShowSim could do more complicated things that Finale cant, atleast not for now.

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    Member Array GK's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by strobes View Post
    In the industry you have 3 systems that dominate, all of which cost $$$,
    FireOnes Scriptmaker, ShowSim and Finale.
    Within the next 2 seasons, Finale will dominate the whole market
    Finale may dominate the market for new designers and small companies....There isn't much incentive for those that have been designing for some time (which would include the majority of the display industry) to make a change.

    There are lots more people that use Show Director, Pyrotec Composer, FireMaster, etc. and will continue to do so....many really have little use for 'sim' software.

    GK
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by GK View Post
    Finale may dominate the market for new designers and small companies....There isn't much incentive for those that have been designing for some time (which would include the majority of the display industry) to make a change.

    There are lots more people that use Show Director, Pyrotec Composer, FireMaster, etc. and will continue to do so....many really have little use for 'sim' software.

    GK
    I agree that large companies have no reason to switch software. My post was geared towards new systems that are sold from lets say last year and forward.
    As for people having little use for sim software, thats their loose. It is rather useful for a number of reason, but i rather the competition look upon it as useless.

  7. #7
    super member Array Duncanbullet's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    How much do you think Finale's popularity increase over the next few seasons? Hopefully its starting to be recognized by bigger companies a serious option in designing shows.
    2 Things always on my mind, God and Fireworks
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by Duncanbullet View Post
    How much do you think Finale's popularity increase over the next few seasons? Hopefully its starting to be recognized by bigger companies a serious option in designing shows.
    All the major companies are aware of Finale's software, as to whether they chose to buy it is on them.
    As for how popular its going to become, its hard to put a number on that. It will dominate the others by alot. It is safe to say that because its inexpensive and when a person is buying a system, it almost behooves you to buy it as the cost is tiny when you take into consideration the whole cost of a system. When i say costs of a system, im talking about a panel, 30 plus field mods, slats and wires.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Firework Software

    Choreography software is something that varies greatly and really comes down to personal taste. I prefer ShowSim because the workflow makes the most sense to me. To me it has just the right amount of features and they are pretty intuitive to use. The 3D version also happens to be the "prettiest" of all the simulation software as far as I have seen.

    That said, Finale is a bargain and a great work horse as far as scripting software. It has really come a long way considering it premiered at the Mason City PGI convention in 2009 as pretty much nothing more than one of those click and see fireworks games. They also focused on a workflow that is usually a secondary feature in other software I have seen. This can make choreography very quick, but I find precision to be a little bit tedious. However, the beauty of the Finale software is in it's designers and their willingness to change certain features. Hopefully there will be an update this Spring that makes more sense to me.

    FireOne's Scriptmaker is not a bad tool but I personally think it's plagued with too many options. If I remember correctly, there are 5 or 6 different ways to script a show, including a workflow much like Finale. It's a little clunky, but not useless by any means. Their simulation version seems to clean up some of these features and I think that the shell design is just awesome.

    My personal vote, which once again comes down to the user, goes for ShowSim 3D. My second favorite software is actually a project that never got finished or released. It was the most intuitive, cleanest, and simplest software I've seen but it was unfortunately too buggy to fix.

    More on topic:

    We can't forget the StarFire software, which includes a timecode maker, script editor, and a complete interface to link your computer and panel to upload, test, and shoot a show. It comes free with the purchase of a StarFire controller.

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    Member Array GK's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by strobes View Post
    I agree that large companies have no reason to switch software. My post was geared towards new systems that are sold from lets say last year and forward.
    As for people having little use for sim software, thats their loose. It is rather useful for a number of reason, but i rather the competition look upon it as useless.
    Useful as a potential sales tool, perhaps....They are handy for checking your work to make sure nothing got mixed up....

    Personally I think that sim software limits your creativity. A great display designer is an artist IMO, a great display can be created with design software, a spreadsheet, or pencil and paper. Software doesn't create art.....Digital firing systems allowed designers to do what they imagined could be done the firing system is a tool as is the design software. You can have the best tools in the world...it takes something more to create.

    Maybe its the current belief that everybody is famous, but I don't believe simply having a sim program can make someone a good display designer any more than having a .wav editor can make you a composer or producer.

    GK
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by GK View Post
    . Software doesn't create art.....
    GK
    But its another tool in the arsenal.

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    Default Re: Firework Software

    It's all about bar graphs for each effect and ability to make timer chains. Finale needs this to compete with Showsim.

    It's all about user license fees also. Please Mr barker can I install a copy of my 4000 SM, yes give me another grand to add the other 100 you have already given me.

    DB -Why are all my orders only panels and modules....mmmmm. I will never discount software or rails. I dont give a shit I have worldwide dominance of the market and people are shit scared of using third party software should it turn F1 into F None.

    French Pyromotion was good back in the old days.
    Last edited by up in smoke; January 13th, 2012 at 06:44 PM.

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    Default Re: Firework Software

    I definitely see the attraction with the sim programs, especially finale fireworks. Many only get to design a handful of real shows every year and these programs give them an outlet to enhance their skills. I am in a fortunate position to be able to design a lot of displays each year to try new looks and work on getting better.

    My biggest problem with the sim programs is that they are too perfect. The comets all go the same height. The shells break perfectly in the sky. The z cakes all burn exactly the same. Fireworks shows are never perfect and you can find some sort of mistake on every one. The sim programs are like taking a freshly recorded song and running it through Pro Tools to fix the musicians mistakes to make it perfect.

    With that being said, I love the fact that there are so many people who enjoy using the sim software to practice and create. When they pop up that they are required for a bid spec, that is another story.

    my 2 cents...

    RV

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    super member Array Duncanbullet's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Like GK said,
    Software can take you only as far as the designer can.
    All the software does is allow you to put your ideas to work, you can do the same thing with a pencil and a piece of paper, but it would be alot harder.

    I think that there also never needs to be just 1 main software that everybody uses, i think the great thing about having differnt software is the ability to create diverse displays, same thing goes for firing system, if everbody used 1 type of system, where would the diversty be? I dont see Billy Joe across the street useing FireOne, but i dont see PyroCo using and ODA CD/10Q.

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    2 Things always on my mind, God and Fireworks
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by pyrotecnico View Post
    When they pop up that they are required for a bid spec, that is another story.

    RV
    Funny how the expectation is to do a full show design complete with music just for the bid.
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthTexasPyro View Post
    Funny how the expectation is to do a full show design complete with music just for the bid.
    It's absurd when that is requested.

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    Member Array GK's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthTexasPyro View Post
    Funny how the expectation is to do a full show design complete with music just for the bid.
    Quote Originally Posted by pyrotecnico View Post
    It's absurd when that is requested.
    Sometimes its unavoidable because somebody got brainwashed that thats what they "need" to have.

    It really frustrating when you find out you were just a "required" bid and the customer had no intention of giving the show to anyone but their 'buddies'. They were required to put the show out to bid....so they did and you spend time and money in putting together a great plan just to have it hit the wastebasket immediately after the bid opening.

    I even had a few bids where I designed a show for the proposal....when I went to the show (shot by someone else) I got to hear my soundtrack with mostly my script being shot.....

    I guess one of my problems with sim programs is that it reduces something as amazing as fireworks to a video game....the sims in my imagination are much better.....'course I never saw the point of guitar hero either .

    GK
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    I think the sims are great tools. In my real job I have lots of tools for fixing cars. It takes a talented and knowledgeable person to make the tools work and be useful. The sim software helps a designer visualize what the end result will be. Most people know that it's a perfect case scenario and the final outcome will be close to what the screen shows. I've had some great ideas that after siming look horrible. If not for the software I'd have wasted time and money on a bad effect. I don't see sim software as a video game, It's just another tool like a Lolly poke or wire stripper that makes life easier. Who doesn't like easier?

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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by pyro70_30 View Post
    I think the sims are great tools. In my real job I have lots of tools for fixing cars. It takes a talented and knowledgeable person to make the tools work and be useful. The sim software helps a designer visualize what the end result will be. Most people know that it's a perfect case scenario and the final outcome will be close to what the screen shows. I've had some great ideas that after siming look horrible. If not for the software I'd have wasted time and money on a bad effect. I don't see sim software as a video game, It's just another tool like a Lolly poke or wire stripper that makes life easier. Who doesn't like easier?
    I definitely see your point especially if you are spending your own $ on product. Part of the fun and rush for me is to see if what I imagined during design works when the display is fired. I am a little old school when it comes to these things!

    RV

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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Quote Originally Posted by GK View Post
    Sometimes its unavoidable because somebody got brainwashed that thats what they "need" to have.

    It really frustrating when you find out you were just a "required" bid and the customer had no intention of giving the show to anyone but their 'buddies'. They were required to put the show out to bid....so they did and you spend time and money in putting together a great plan just to have it hit the wastebasket immediately after the bid opening.

    GK
    That really sucks when that happens. It really sucks more when you put in atleast 20 hours of your time and money into it when they are only going threw the motions.

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    Default Re: Firework Software

    In Europe, i don't know any society that simulate their show exept for very big show and only for some sequences to show to the client.
    It's takes a lot of time and we have not yet enought !
    In summer some compagnies have to compose with two composers (for exemple) about 8 fireworks per week (and not small one).
    How do you do to add a simulation ?

    You have better to take care of your team for the day of the show, your racks, trucks, labels for the products, ...

    Honestly, most of the time, simulation is just for people to play with at home.

    Speak about Finale soft to Parente Fireworks, Pyrovision, Igual or Groupe F, they have never used it and will never use it.
    We already have soft for about ten years like ShowDirector witch have a simulation part never used.


    Otherwise a good soft to play with, not expenseive is FWSim.
    My fireworks pictures : http://www.fireworks-pictures.com/

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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Pyroman, some of the companies you mentioned showed a LOT of interest, and some even purchased Finale at last years ISF in Portugal and I bet they do even better in a couple months in Malta.

    The old crowd in the industry is showing it's age. Things cannot remain the same, they will get left behind it's happening all around just open your eyes.

    Everyone thinks their way is the best.

    Choreography cannot be given an advantage by software or secrets, it is something you either have a talent for, or you do not. I have seen people with the best product, firing system and crews in the world shoot shitty displays. You have to be able to make the audience feel the music, lose themselves in the lights and become one with the production, blocking out all else in their world at least for the duration of the show.

    Sim software is not a replacement for lack of visions, rather one of the tools along the path to making it happen.
    Last edited by shrapnel; January 19th, 2012 at 08:51 AM.
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    I think you are right.
    But i also think that the main goal for this society is to offer complement when they answer to an offer for a client.
    It's a complement as a visual for the client.

    A good composer don't need any king of simulation.
    In my point of view, a soft we use to simulate the fireworks in order to compose it don't provide a good vision for composition.
    You have to feel and know your products not to arrange some products you simulate because you don't now it well on a screen.
    I saw some simulations on YouTube and they use too much one shot per cue. It's good for a sequence but not for the full show.


    Good side of Finale soft or others is it can gathered some works witch was done in different softs before like composition + labes + plan, ...
    My fireworks pictures : http://www.fireworks-pictures.com/

  24. #24
    PyInTheSky.com Array WildWilli's Avatar
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    Default Re: Firework Software

    Speaking of fireworks software, I just got setup with Finale Inventory. Will and the gang have done it again with another fine product from Finale. Seems a little expensive at first until you realize what value it brings to a complete and searchable inventory management system. Very intuitive. Two thumbs up!
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