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Thread: Can you tape cakes together?

  1. #1

    Default Can you tape cakes together?

    I was thinking about taping pairs of cakes together (non anglesd cakes) but was wondering if there is an additional safety issue. My idea was to tape a few pairs together then tape them to the boards so when fused together, I would have 2 200G cakes firing at the same time. Anyone tried this?

  2. #2

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Yep, go for it. I reccomend staking them as well

  3. #3
    Subforum Moderator Array QMAN's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Yea you can do that. Its a good way to keep 200 gram cakes from tipping.

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  4. #4

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Definitely can. Gives cakes a wider footprint and keeps them from tipping.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shooting Star Pyro View Post
    Yep, go for it. I reccomend staking them as well
    Ground is too hard to stake where I shoot but I will be taping them down to a board as well.

    Thanks for reassuring me guys. I was kinda concerned about a possible blowout and thought about what kinda damage one would do to the other cake.

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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by QMAN View Post
    Yea you can do that. Its a good way to keep 200 gram cakes from tipping.

    QMAN
    this ^

    Quote Originally Posted by AnonyMouse View Post
    Definitely can. Gives cakes a wider footprint and keeps them from tipping.
    and this ^

    if you can't stake the cakes then duct taping multiple cakes together is a great may to go, but i wouldn't do any doubles, i'd do them in multiples of four. if you only tape two together you are only increasing the width in one direction. it can still tip over on the narrow side only now you have twice as much pointing in the wrong direction.

    if you block them up in 4's it makes the cakes much less likely to tip because you've made the footprint 4x as big.

    one thing to be careful of is the taller 200 grams or the strange shaped cakes (like diamonds or triangles) sometimes it's not enough to block them into a grouping of 4. with atom splitters i end up blocking them into 6's just for some extra weight.

    another tip to shooting on pavement...pallets and wire.

    take your cakes, lay em out the way you want, then use some bailing wire to go up and over the tops of the cakes (between the tubes) and then back under the slats of the pallet. then you just use a pair of vise grips and twist it tight.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    I see what you are saying. Its not on pavement, its actually very hard packed dirt/clay. My plan was to tape down to plywood, maybe even glue them down too. I wont have access to pallets.

    Ok, assuming the fuse is at the bottom of the cake, how do you fues it when you put it in a block of four?

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    Member Array St1dinoh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by Midak View Post
    I see what you are saying. Its not on pavement, its actually very hard packed dirt/clay. My plan was to tape down to plywood, maybe even glue them down too. I wont have access to pallets.

    Ok, assuming the fuse is at the bottom of the cake, how do you fues it when you put it in a block of four?
    as far as the tapeing goes, just run a few rings around the tops bottom and middle. leave the fuse exposed and you'll be good to go. you can also run a line of tape across the bottom to give more support.

    with most 500 gram cakes,the visco fuse is located on a corner. if the cake is square it's easy, but if it's a rectangle it'll be a bit more difficult.

    depending on how you want to fuse them and how you want them to fire you can fuse it in a few different ways.

    if you want to send it all up fast, keep the fuses together inthe center and run a single line of fast visco down the center of the four cakes. you can get all 4 of them fused to a single length of yellow and have them all lit in about 2 seconds.

    if you wantr to slow it down a bit, have the visco run a horseshoe around the perimiter and attach all the fuses.
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  9. #9

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by Midak View Post
    I see what you are saying. Its not on pavement, its actually very hard packed dirt/clay. My plan was to tape down to plywood, maybe even glue them down too. I wont have access to pallets.

    Ok, assuming the fuse is at the bottom of the cake, how do you fues it when you put it in a block of four?
    St1dinoh is right. Block of four is much better than block of 2.

    As for fusing, here's how I do it (for square/rectangle cakes):

    STEP 1: Have all the fuses facing the outside of the block, not the inside. That way you can set it up to get a fuse at every corner (assuming all the fuses are on the same side for example bottom right).

    STEP 2: Duct tape the cakes all together and make sure one strip of duct tape runs right by the fuse on the cakes.

    STEP 3: Get some fuse and go around the entire block of 4. Run the fuse on top of the duct tape closest to the fuse and zip tie (or tape)the cake fuse to the leader (main) fuse where they meet up. Then place duct tape/masking tape/foil tape over the fuse.

    P.S. if you want them all to go up at once, then st1dinoh's technique of setting them up is the best way. I like them going off one after another so I use fuse with a 24 sec/ft. burn time.

    Hope this helps. Enjoy the show.
    Last edited by AnonyMouse; April 24th, 2009 at 12:41 PM.

  10. #10
    Member Array St1dinoh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by AnonyMouse View Post
    St1dinoh is right. Block of four is much better than block of 2.

    As for fusing, here's how I do it (for square/rectangle cakes):

    STEP 1: Have all the fuses facing the outside of the block, not the inside. That way you can set it up to get a fuse at every corner (assuming all the fuses are on the same side for example bottom right).

    STEP 2: Duct tape the cakes all together and make sure one strip of duct tape runs right by the fuse on the cakes.

    STEP 3: Get some fuse and go around the entire block of 4. Run the fuse on top of the duct tape closest to the fuse and zip tie (or tape)the cake fuse to the leader (main) fuse where they meet up. Then place duct tape/masking tape/foil tape over the fuse.

    P.S. if you want them all to go up at once, then st1dinoh's technique of setting them up is the best way. I like them going off one after another so I use fuse with a 24 sec/ft. burn time.

    Hope this helps. Enjoy the show.
    to be fair, the best way to explain this is... "it depends".

    the cake speed (duration) and size will change the way you want to fuse them. if i'm fusing up a case of something fast (like pyramid or watch it buddy) and i want it to fire back to back, i can get away with running a 6 second fast yellow around the perimiter. if i wanted to slow fire a case of something with a much longer duration, i'd need to use the slow visco.

    if you want to shoot them two at a time and save on some visco you can simply block two together with the fuses together and attach both of them to a length of visco, then run that visco leader out the front between the two to the next block of two fuses. now when you light the visco it'll passfire to two cakes at once, then after a short pause the last two cakes will fire.

    or...

    just to be difficult...

    take two cakes, block them together and run the fuse about two inches over the top of the cakes. do it again (two more cakes). now slap em both together and tape the two visco leaders together.

    when you light the leader it'll light both, then those will light all 4 cakes at the same time (within a few seconds).
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  11. #11

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by St1dinoh View Post
    to be fair, the best way to explain this is... "it depends".
    You're absolutely correct. You have to factor in duration times, shape of cakes, and how you want them to go off. Soo much to think about.

    But you gotta love the end result.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    I didn't read the entire thread "word-for-word", so if it's already mentioned, please excuse the redundancy.
    You also need to be aware of angle-firing cakes. Be careful not to place an angle-firer to either side of a taller cake. The angle-firer will hit the taller cake. In front of (or behind) is OK, but not to either side.
    Also, be careful not to place a shorter cake to either side of an angle-firer so that the shorter cake will be slightly underneath the top edge of the angle-firer. It will hit the top edge of the angle-firing cake. Again, in front of (or behind) is OK, but not to either side.
    Last edited by lava; April 24th, 2009 at 04:24 PM.

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    Subforum Moderator Array QMAN's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by Midak View Post
    I see what you are saying. Its not on pavement, its actually very hard packed dirt/clay. My plan was to tape down to plywood, maybe even glue them down too. I wont have access to pallets.

    Ok, assuming the fuse is at the bottom of the cake, how do you fues it when you put it in a block of four?

    I am putting everything on OSB again this year, but I had some break loose and tip last year. I have been told to only use Liquid Nails or Gorilla Glue on them. I had planned to pair stuff together this year like St1dinoh had suggested, but I am still a little gun shy. To be honest I was considering running some lightwight wire through the cakes between the tubes and strap them down to the board. Maybe thats over kill, but I just don't want anything tipping. I think one of my other problems was I used 1/4" thick OSB last year and it flexed quite a bit when the 500 grammers were firing. I am going to use 1/2" or maybe even 3/4" in my cakeboards this year.

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  14. #14

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    What the others have said is good advice. I tape cakes together all the time, even blocks of 500g cakes. I think the first I remember talking about this was Kouvang, years ago, I've been doing it ever since.

    In case someone else hasn't mentioned it, use caution when fusing if you have a run of fuse cross over the tape that you are using to secure the cakes, it could burn through and make the cakes less secure. I've never had any issues with this, but while cleaning up I've noticed the tape has gotten burned through before.

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  15. #15

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by glittertime View Post
    I didn't read the entire thread "word-for-word", so if it's already mentioned, please excuse the redundancy.
    You also need to be aware of angle-firing cakes. Be careful not to place an angle-firer to either side of a taller cake. The angle-firer will hit the taller cake. In front of (or behind) is OK, but not to either side.
    Also, be careful not to place a shorter cake to either side of an angle-firer so that the shorter cake will be slightly underneath the top edge of the angle-firer. It will hit the top edge of the angle-firing cake. Again, in front of (or behind) is OK, but not to either side.
    lol, you didnt even read the first sentence of the OP but I appreciate your thoughts.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    I have yet to meet the ground that can stop a concrete stake and a sledge hammer. Especially if you keep your concrete stakes at a nice point.



    Quote Originally Posted by Midak View Post
    Ground is too hard to stake where I shoot but I will be taping them down to a board as well.

    Thanks for reassuring me guys. I was kinda concerned about a possible blowout and thought about what kinda damage one would do to the other cake.

  17. #17
    Moderator Array lava's Avatar
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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by Midak View Post
    lol, you didnt even read the first sentence of the OP but I appreciate your thoughts.
    Actually I had read "most" of the thread (maybe just over 1/2). People were giving advice on how to tape cakes together, and what to be concerned about, but I didn't notice where anyone mentioned being careful about angled cakes and shorter/taller cakes when doing it (yep, even 200g cakes).

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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by QMAN View Post
    I had planned to pair stuff together this year like St1dinoh had suggested, but I am still a little gun shy. To be honest I was considering running some lightwight wire through the cakes between the tubes and strap them down to the board. Maybe thats over kill, but I just don't want anything tipping. I think one of my other problems was I used 1/4" thick OSB last year and it flexed quite a bit when the 500 grammers were firing. I am going to use 1/2" or maybe even 3/4" in my cakeboards this year.

    QMAN
    hey Q, use pallets if you want to use wire. just take the tops off your cakes to expose the tubes, then sneak some wire in between a row of tubes. if you use a pallet to set up on you can just wire the cakes to the slats of the pallet real easy.l

    works great, just inspect the pallet first to make sure the boards aren't going to come loose.

    Quote Originally Posted by glittertime View Post
    Actually I had read "most" of the thread (maybe just over 1/2). People were giving advice on how to tape cakes together, and what to be concerned about, but I didn't notice where anyone mentioned being careful about angled cakes and shorter/taller cakes when doing it (yep, even 200g cakes).
    i think the intention wasn't to pair different cakes together, but to pair ones from the same case.

    like a 4/1 500 gram, shooting it by the case.
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  19. #19

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by St1dinoh View Post
    i think the intention wasn't to pair different cakes together, but to pair ones from the same case.

    like a 4/1 500 gram, shooting it by the case.
    200G cakes actually but yes, pairs as in two of the same or i guess if 4 works. The idea was to double up the shots going up for more effect.

    Yes, as I mentioned, no angled cakes.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    With all the talk about boards and pallets, I want to chime in here. I've been building boards the whole time I've been shooting pyro and used everything from duct tape to liquid nails to silicone caulk to hold them down...no more. I staked my whole show this past weekend with the exception of some angled boards I built (used liquid nails and a kicker board on them). Much faster set up than building boards. I used wooden stakes, but like Shooting Star said, I haven't found any ground yet that you can't drive rebar stakes into. Couple stakes in the ground and a couple wraps of duct tape and no cake is tipping over.

    As far as fusing and taping, for cakes that are odd shaped like Exotic Mash or Excellent Trip, I set them up with one odd shaped cake in the middle and then puzzle the rest together. You can attach the fuse to the center cake and run it between the others and then around them as you put together the puzzle.
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  21. #21

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    My technique, exactly. Never (crossed fingers) had a cake tip over.


    Quote Originally Posted by coachtimmyj View Post
    With all the talk about boards and pallets, I want to chime in here. I've been building boards the whole time I've been shooting pyro and used everything from duct tape to liquid nails to silicone caulk to hold them down...no more. I staked my whole show this past weekend with the exception of some angled boards I built (used liquid nails and a kicker board on them). Much faster set up than building boards. I used wooden stakes, but like Shooting Star said, I haven't found any ground yet that you can't drive rebar stakes into. Couple stakes in the ground and a couple wraps of duct tape and no cake is tipping over.

    As far as fusing and taping, for cakes that are odd shaped like Exotic Mash or Excellent Trip, I set them up with one odd shaped cake in the middle and then puzzle the rest together. You can attach the fuse to the center cake and run it between the others and then around them as you put together the puzzle.

  22. #22

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    My technique, exactly. Never (crossed fingers) had a cake tip over.
    Just trying to do what the pros do. Many times I talk with a pro shooter they kind of cringe at the idea of attaching cakes to boards. They stake everything for a reason, so it won't tip over. Not that you didn't know this Star (I'm sure there is a ton of stuff I could learn from you), just pointing it out for those that haven't considered the option of staking cakes.
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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    And of course - if you are gluing to a board - you can use the strongest glue in the world, it will only be as strong as the maybe damp card / paper on the base of your cake . . .
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  24. #24

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    I ALLWAYS remove the paper bottoms and cardboard down to the tubes so liquid nails makes contact with something solid.I then feel i did my best safety wise.I also think the wire idea is excellent.If they have wood bases already i stop when I get to the clean wood.

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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    that's the best thing to do with 200's. i recommend using scotch blue tape to fuse everything together.

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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    if you have any carpenters in the area, get some of their scraps and use to secure your cakes......I like to put my cakes on a longer piece of 2 inch lumber and secure short 2x4 chunks with screws to hold everything in place. I've made some great mortar racks with just scraps and a screwgun. got a question too.....how many seconds to burn one foot of visco? thanks!

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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by banger View Post
    how many seconds to burn one foot of visco? thanks!
    There are lots of varieties, ranging from perhaps half a second a foot up to 35 seconds a foot or more. Plus, humidity can play a factor as well.

    Best thing to do is test a two to three foot piece of the visco you plan to use, and then time it. There will always be some discrepancies, but it will get you close.

    Keep your rolls of visco in ziplocs to help keep them away from moisture.
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  28. #28

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    Quote Originally Posted by QMAN View Post
    I am putting everything on OSB again this year, but I had some break loose and tip last year. I have been told to only use Liquid Nails or Gorilla Glue on them. I had planned to pair stuff together this year like St1dinoh had suggested, but I am still a little gun shy. To be honest I was considering running some lightwight wire through the cakes between the tubes and strap them down to the board. Maybe thats over kill, but I just don't want anything tipping. I think one of my other problems was I used 1/4" thick OSB last year and it flexed quite a bit when the 500 grammers were firing. I am going to use 1/2" or maybe even 3/4" in my cakeboards this year.
    Yeah I used 1/4" on year; luckily it was from when I was just lighting singles from Phantom. I've been using 1/2" OSB ever since.

    I like to block cakes together as well using a mid-grade duct tape. Doesn't matter if they're from the same case, as long as they are of similar size/height. Do be careful of angled cakes though. As for securing to boards, I'm a fan of Gorilla Tape.

  29. #29

    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    I have a new respect for staking and taping. It's amazing how much even some heavy 500 gram cakes jump around while firing.

    Have to use good tape though, else it may come loose in the sun.

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    Default Re: Can you tape cakes together?

    I have access to alot of sandbags?
    Any one have any experience using sandbags to stabilze cakes or groups of cakes?

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