Rack construction check

[wooguay]

What do you think, pilot holes drilled and 1 5/8"s dry wall screws, will this hold up. Also how tight is too tight on shells in the fiberglass mortors? The excals drop it no problem but critical acclaims are very tight.
thanks all.

http://www.pyroreview.com/gallery/data/500/1561IMG_0501.JPG
http://www.pyroreview.com/gallery/data/500/1561IMG_0500.JPG
http://www.pyroreview.com/gallery/data/500/1561IMG_0499.JPG

[MNPyro]

What do you think, pilot holes drilled and 1 5/8"s dry wall screws, will this hold up. Also how tight is too tight on shells in the fiberglass mortors? The excals drop it no problem but critical acclaims are very tight.
thanks all.


Critical Acclaims are as "neccessary" to be "loose" as they are just stars that shoot upwards.

Having them tight in the mortar and a tall mortar will just make the stars stay more condensed as they travel up the tube and out. Having CAs loose in the tubes would allow them to "lose their path" per se and scatter a little more.

So, to stop rambling, don't worry so much about the CAs, as long as they fit, and you don't need to use a lot of force to get them down.

MNPyro

[wooguay]

cool ill do a test tonight on it, hows the contruction look seem alright to with hold the lift charge of excal? Also i had a pyrotech display work look at the tubes and he said that excals might break the tube during lift? I doubt that is true has anyone had the problem?

[MNPyro]

cool ill do a test tonight on it, hows the contruction look seem alright to with hold the lift charge of excal? Also i had a pyrotech display work look at the tubes and he said that excals might break the tube during lift? I doubt that is true has anyone had the problem?

I highly doubt it, I set off many excals in my tubes last year, and I know several others have also with no problems. I had 150 tubes last year, some god some testing before hand with various shells, including excals, and during my show each tube had 2 shells go through it no problems.(meaning I reloaded once ;-))

MNPyro

P.S. As for the rack construction, it looks sturdy enough not to break or anything. But I am assuming you either have multiples of these that you will be putting together, or you are driving a stake to secure it?

[wooguay]

Yeah i have 10 of theses rack for mobility and differnt setups. But no im going to most likely mount a 2x4 to the side as a leg so that it wont move.

[Deweycoon]

You built this rack the way we should all be building them...with wood on all four sides of the mortar.
Most of us are building racks in multiple rows of 10 and no wood in between each mortar.

[wooguay]

thanks deweycoon and all for the good comments, didnt realize i that i never responded back. Tested a xcal and CA mine and boy were they loud definely caught me off gaurd. I tested at 9:30 thinking the mines were going to be quite and i chained two together and right when that first one went off i was thinking who was going to be the fire to call the cops or start yelling when that second one was going to go. Anyways, Do you think that a mix of HDPE and fiberglass will have any effects in the performace of the show. Seeing as Colin has run out this year (a real shame, now that i started work) i am looking to puchase hdpe. Also i know this isnt the area but i dont want to start too many differnt topics, do you think it it better to ematch as much as possible or better to depend on fuse and ematch. As in more leader fuses and less ematches or more ematched and less leader. thanks again all

[Deweycoon]

Mixing HDPE and fiberglass is fine.Theuy are different sizes so it may be hard to make a rack that will hold both.

I think both fusing and e-matching work fine... it depends on personnal preference.
E-matching as much as possible make the show look more professional because you choose when the next cake fires.

[pyrochris]

thanks deweycoon and all for the good comments, didnt realize i that i never responded back. Tested a xcal and CA mine and boy were they loud definely caught me off gaurd. I tested at 9:30 thinking the mines were going to be quite and i chained two together and right when that first one went off i was thinking who was going to be the fire to call the cops or start yelling when that second one was going to go. Anyways, Do you think that a mix of HDPE and fiberglass will have any effects in the performace of the show. Seeing as Colin has run out this year (a real shame, now that i started work) i am looking to puchase hdpe. Also i know this isnt the area but i dont want to start too many differnt topics, do you think it it better to ematch as much as possible or better to depend on fuse and ematch. As in more leader fuses and less ematches or more ematched and less leader. thanks again all
http://www.cannonfuse.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=891 there you go! very good price for fibeglass tubes. Also Kellfire.com sells them too.

[Deweycoon]

http://www.cannonfuse.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=891 there you go! very good price for fibeglass tubes. Also Kellfire.com sells them too.
I just checked pricing and pyrogears 15" HDPE would be $.30 cheaper per tube...shipping included.
I have bothfiberglass and hdpe, it is a personal preference on which to buy.

[Supdawg]

cool ill do a test tonight on it, hows the contruction look seem alright to with hold the lift charge of excal? Also i had a pyrotech display work look at the tubes and he said that excals might break the tube during lift? I doubt that is true has anyone had the problem?
They wont hurt the tubes, but the do stress a rack. I have broken pieces of both of my racks shooting piggybacked excals.

http://www.pyroreview.com/gallery/data/520/153DSCN1432.JPG
http://www.pyroreview.com/gallery/data/520/153DSCN1371.JPG

[RESET]

Sup, were those setting flat on the ground? I ask because my racks are similar to the bottom pic but with a single row. I don't want any issues with my first racks. I will be firing single excals from each tube in rapid succession but not all at once. My modules are glued with gorilla glue and nails from the side every 2 inches in predrilled holes. I would post a pic but it takes for ever. Maybe after I have them all finished. Sorry to hijack but I too didn't want to start another thread.

[Supdawg]

Sup, were those setting flat on the ground? I ask because my racks are similar to the bottom pic but with a single row. I don't want any issues with my first racks. I will be firing single excals from each tube in rapid succession but not all at once. My modules are glued with gorilla glue and nails from the side every 2 inches in predrilled holes. I would post a pic but it takes for ever. Maybe after I have them all finished. Sorry to hijack but I too didn't want to start another thread.
Yes, flat on asphalt.

[wooguay]

Thats interesting supdawg, but i think piggybacking the shells is what caused the stress i would think because the shocks being so consistant in the same location after one another would mess up the bottom... but what do i know? I only shot one without glueing the tubes down at all. And it seemed okay, no jumping etc. Also those fiberglass tubes are expensive once it comes down to shipping and all, HDPE isnt too expensive and im near tampa right next to the manufacturer i forget the name "I something" it was disscussed. Anyways hijack away all the more differnt info in one thread will make it more imporant ;) . Oh yeah, is glue really nessasary for the tubes? or can it be done without?

[pyrochris]

I just checked pricing and pyrogears 15" HDPE would be $.30 cheaper per tube...shipping included.
I have bothfiberglass and hdpe, it is a personal preference on which to buy.
these aren't HDPE these are black fiberglass tubing.

[shrapnel]

If I may guys, having built and tested racks extensively, in the pics above the sides of the rack, (bottom rails) are screwed to the sides of the plywood bases, thereby joining the weakest part of the rail to the weakest part of the plywood, the end grain. You will get much better results by screwing through the bottom of the plywood and into the bottom of the rail, sitting on top of the base. This method runs the screw across the grain of both woods, instead of with the grain, the way it looks like wooguay did in the top pics, those racks should hold up fine. All this being said, piggybacking shells as you know is at your own risk, neither shells or racks were designed to be used this way.

[Dan]

I agree with Shrapnels assessment. After looking at Supdawgs racs with the "splits" you can see they split along the "grain" so it leads me to believe that no pilot holes were drilled, and also it looks like "pine" was used as well, which is very soft wood, and very prone to splitting.

Be sure and predrill pilot holes, and use either a plywood, or hardwwood to make your racks.

Dan

[Deweycoon]

these aren't HDPE these are black fiberglass tubing.

I know Cannon Fuse is selling black fiberglass....my point was that pyrogear is able to sell me 15" HDPE mortars for $.30 less with the shipping figured in.

[pyrochris]

I know Cannon Fuse is selling black fiberglass....my point was that pyrogear is able to sell me 15" HDPE mortars for $.30 less with the shipping figured in.
Oh, ok because you said HDPE, i buy hdpe at pyrogear too, but he wanted fiberglass since colin was sold out. :D

[Supdawg]

I agree with Shrapnels assessment. After looking at Supdawgs racs with the "splits" you can see they split along the "grain" so it leads me to believe that no pilot holes were drilled, and also it looks like "pine" was used as well, which is very soft wood, and very prone to splitting.

Be sure and predrill pilot holes, and use either a plywood, or hardwwood to make your racks.

Dan
No sir, pilots were drilled. Pine was clean as a baby's bottom. :cool:

To answer. Yes, the split pieces were replaced in a 3/4" plywood piece.

[RESET]

Oh yeah, is glue really nessasary for the tubes? or can it be done without?

I'm not sure if this was directed at me or in general. I am gluing and nailing the racks, the tubes are put in loose. I glue and clamp for 8 hours then predrill and nail. I am putting the nails in from the side so that the nails are not in the same direction as the force from the lift.

[wooguay]

RESET, the question was for in general. But im sure it is a plus for putting glue but it is an extra cost at this point. Everythigns put together and then i have to unscrew 10 racks :oops: so that will be work... :rolleyes: thanks again all

[MNPyro]

At one point, Don or yeager or possibly someone else said something to the extent: "You don't want to use glue as having the rack 'give' a little is a good thing, and it will help prevent damage to the racks"

I think it was more in reference to "super securing" the racks with high strength glue of some sort, I am not sure, and was unable to recover the post.

I don't know if their opinion on this is the same, but just an FYI and whomever made that statement can chime in and say what was originally said.

MNPyro

[pyrochris]

At one point, Don or yeager or possibly someone else said something to the extent: "You don't want to use glue as having the rack 'give' a little is a good thing, and it will help prevent damage to the racks"

I think it was more in reference to "super securing" the racks with high strength glue of some sort, I am not sure, and was unable to recover the post.

I don't know if their opinion on this is the same, but just an FYI and whomever made that statement can chime in and say what was originally said.

MNPyro
You dont really need to have glue on the plugs, it just helps seal it so the shells go as high as possible. I have heavy duty staples in mine and they work fine.

[shaneth]

to go a little off topic but avoid starting a WHOLE NEW THREAD, i have a question about medium density fiberboard or MDF. has anyone used this with rack construction and would this be safe to use as a plywood alternative?

[shrapnel]

NO. NO. NO! Avoid the lure of the fact that MDF is attractive and inexpensive, It has no grain to it like a natural wood therefore making it brittle by nature. MDF's main use is in furniture manufacturing, the surface of the material is impressively hard and dent resistant! MDF also in inferior in holding fasteners, screws or nails will pull out of MDF with much less effort than ply or real wood. ;)

[MNPyro]

You dont really need to have glue on the plugs, it just helps seal it so the shells go as high as possible. I have heavy duty staples in mine and they work fine.

Chris, I wasn't talking about on the tubes themselve. I was talking about the adjoining pieces of the rack.

And the minimal amount of gas escaping from that tiny area around the plug won't make much if any difference as per the height the shell reaches. Now, if you have a hole through the center or lots of gas escaping, that is another issue. And mind you, even that hole would have to be decently sized.

MNPyro